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  • Message from CACC #3 organizer

    Whoa. What a roast. I haven't read the forums for a couple of days. Looks like alot of unhappy competitors from this past weekend.

    I would like to comment on the decision to drop to 3 runs on Sunday, and the consensus that the course design was not "fun".

    Hindsight is always 20/20, and in retrospect, we should have announced three runs with the possibility of a fourth at the drivers meeting, instead of saying we were going to get 4, and then drop it to 3. I would have to say that the decision was mine to drop to three runs, but I had some competitors raise concerns that we were 5 hours getting through the "morning" runs, and would have had the trophy presentation at 8:30 if we had run the 4th run. I would have also loved a fourth run to try and catch the Talon.

    If it's any consellation, the seat time we had with our 3 runs on the 60 second course was more than 4 runs at 40 seconds. But that doesn't take away the frustration most competitors are feeling after having the fourth run cancelled.

    As for the course design, I'm not going to give an opinion on its "fun" factor , but I will say it was unique. When was the last time we had a slalom the full length of the lot? (Tradex 2 years ago I think).

    Course design for a Champ event is different than for a closed club. At a closed club, I have no problem testing the course until I'm blue in the face to get it just right. While designing a Champ event course, I am reluctant to test it as diligently as a closed club, as I am in an ultra competitive class and do not want the advantage gained by testing the course ahead of time. I did not drive the Champ course on Sat, but rather deferred to Doug Bayley's feedback on the flow and pace of the course. He drove it in an Audi Quattro and Rob Bruce's Cavalier. (and no, Rob did not drive it either)

    As for a course design school, the solo director (me) had planned and still hopes to hold a solo 2 course design school sometime this year. For those who were at the CACC AGM this past spring you will recall that I even budgeted for it.

    Oliver Brett
    Chief Organizer, CACC #3

  • #2
    Thanks for replying in suck a cool manner Oliver - looks like my rant in that other thread started quite a flame war - my bad. My appologies.

    I was not out to attack anyone. I was just expressing my frustrations - just my point of view. And yes - I did have a bad event - and yes, I am just a bitter looser At least I admit it.

    But there is always something good to come of the bad stuff - and a course design school would be a great idea - even if it serves no other purpose than for the existing course designers to get together and compare notes.

    Farz made me the offer to design a course at the upcoming VCMC anniversary event - and I would love to do so - but I am still not sure if I am going to be in town on that weekend or not. If I am, Farz, I would love to design sundays course - but if you need someone else who can commit to it right away thats cool too. I will let you know if I am going to be around as soon as I know.

    Course testing for champ events is also a difficult issue. You want to have a course that meets your design ideas, safety is a major issue, fun factor, length, etc... and you need to have the course tested to make sure all these things are in line - but who should do the testing??? If the course designer tests it till he's blue in the face and he is a competitor at the event then his competitors have every right to cry fowl as that is a definate competitive advantage. Heck even seeing the course in advance is an advantage - but to a much smaller degree. I dont know of a good solution to the issue of course testing - but I know that it needs to be done (testing the course) and we need to find a way to do it such that everyone is satisfied - both designers and competitors. Lets think about that one.

    As far as the number of runs goes - heck we ran for years with only 3 runs. I don't have a problem with that. 4 runs is nice - if it is done properly. In order to make 4 runs possible the courses have been made short as of recent years - and my personal oppinion (once again I intend no offense to anyone) is I would rather have 3 runs on a 60-70 second course than 4 runs on a 30-40 second course. Just my preference.

    Perhaps we could take an informal poll on who wants what - ideas?

    Any suggestions?
    Be fast - or be spectacular.
    Pick one.
    Karl Hunter

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    • #3
      <blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Textbook:
      Course testing for champ events is also a difficult issue. You want to have a course that meets your design ideas, safety is a major issue, fun factor, length, etc., and you need to have the course tested to make sure all these things are in line - but who should do the testing???... I dont know of a good solution to the issue of course testing - but I know that it needs to be done (testing the course) and we need to find a way to do it such that everyone is satisfied - both designers and competitors.<hr></blockquote>

      The Steward of the Event can't be a competitor, and is supposed to ensure the course is safe, etc., so why not offer the Steward some runs to test the course? Maybe even offer him/her your own car to do the testing.

      FWIW, I didn't find Sunday's course that awful. I've seen a lot worse. A couple of areas required discipline (the first set of offset slalom gates; the box), but I don't translate that to "technical," nor do I translate "technical" to "not fun"--quite the contrary. Any slalom is an invitation to whack cones, so you have to expect more than your fair share in a 14-cone slalom. Maybe it would have been a better "feature" in a closed club event, but chalk it up to lessons learned and move on.

      --Mike

      Comment


      • #4
        <blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Mike-L:

        ...required discipline....
        ...lessons learned and move on.

        --Mike
        <hr></blockquote>

        Bravo!!!

        Joe
        "...I recommend books. People who don't know what they're talking about are less likely to write a book about the subject...."

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